Combat in YS. Well... What's left of it.

User avatar
Midnight Rambler
Staff
Staff
Posts: 2120
Joined: Thu Feb 10, 2011 11:08 pm
Favorite Aircraft: F-16
Location: Australia
OS: Windows 10
Has thanked: 259 times
Been thanked: 360 times

Combat in YS. Well... What's left of it.

Post by Midnight Rambler » Tue Nov 27, 2012 10:49 am

Kinda awkward to come back and see how dead the military aspect of YS has become.

Are there any squads out there still? I'm not talking about people who have one or two members flying and the rest are MIA - That's called being dead. What I'm talking about are groups of people who regularly fly together and work on their flying.

From what I can see.... There are none.

I'm one of the biggest advocators of military flying in YS - It was great! But all of that buster, the competition, the skill and excitement that made it fun has died.


So... My question is this: Is there anything we can do to make it exciting again? The old way of having a big squad just doesn't work any more - training is too hard to organise and too few can teach it well/at all.

Useful opinions, anyone?

Edit: Also I'm not the section admin, my rank is messed up.
Image

User avatar
Flake
Core Staff
Core Staff
Posts: 4350
Joined: Thu Feb 10, 2011 8:47 pm
Favorite Aircraft: Boeing F/A-18A
Location: Australia
OS: Windows 10 (x64)
Has thanked: 835 times
Been thanked: 1238 times
Contact:

Re: Combat in YS. Well... What's left of it.

Post by Flake » Tue Nov 27, 2012 11:26 am

I'm going to be completely honest.

I dropped YSRAAF because YSF lacks the functionality to make it what I wanted.

It may be a real kick in the nuts to soji, but this program is not developing fast enough to keep up with everything else. How can we compete with FSX or Xplane or VATSIM at all?

He made his choice to keep YSF closed source. Now the community is dying from lack of interest. I have more then abandoned any hopes of making YSF better then it is. There's no point.

Effective Airlines. Effective Militarys. All foleys.

Recently I've taken coding my own minecraft server from released source code. I'm not looking back, and I'm DEFINANTLY not claiming it as my own work.

Anyone with the ability to code anything of value is smarter then that, and wouldn't do that. It disappoints me that we can't be trusted in this way.

So yeah, this is why I've given up on YSF.
I am an accountant working full-time (and some). I'm not here as often as I would like to be. Send a message if you need me. There are a few people in the community who can get in contact with me urgently if you need - don't be afraid to ask. I just don't check here as frequently as I used to. Sorry!

User avatar
Midnight Rambler
Staff
Staff
Posts: 2120
Joined: Thu Feb 10, 2011 11:08 pm
Favorite Aircraft: F-16
Location: Australia
OS: Windows 10
Has thanked: 259 times
Been thanked: 360 times

Re: Combat in YS. Well... What's left of it.

Post by Midnight Rambler » Tue Nov 27, 2012 11:51 am

Thanks Flake - my view on YS as well.

Anyone else got an idea or summary on YS in general (now we've broached the subject)?
Image

User avatar
Honey Badger
57th Polyvalent Sq
57th Polyvalent Sq
Posts: 1843
Joined: Thu Jun 30, 2011 8:17 pm
Favorite Aircraft: Anything that gets off the ground
Location: From Louisiana, stationed in Alabama
Has thanked: 226 times
Been thanked: 69 times

Re: Combat in YS. Well... What's left of it.

Post by Honey Badger » Tue Nov 27, 2012 12:44 pm

I agree with Flake. If you look at screen caps of the old YSF and the current one, there is little to no difference. I think people see something like that and realize how slow development is going. I really think Soji should allow people to assist with programming. That's why Flightgear went from something that looked a lot like YSF to what is is now.
USAF Computer Systems Programmer (3D0X4)
"Powerpoint Ranger"

User avatar
Crazypilot
Honorary Contributor
Honorary Contributor
Posts: 2578
Joined: Wed Jun 22, 2011 4:22 pm
Favorite Aircraft: F-16C
Location: Pakistan
Has thanked: 192 times
Been thanked: 92 times
Contact:

Re: Combat in YS. Well... What's left of it.

Post by Crazypilot » Tue Nov 27, 2012 1:13 pm

I think we should bring this up to Soji when he comes on the Teamspeak server.
Boneless Pizza

User avatar
Strik3agle98
Contributor
Contributor
Posts: 381
Joined: Mon Apr 18, 2011 10:03 am
Favorite Aircraft: any thing that have double delta wing, twin tailed
Location: in the planet name EARTH
Has thanked: 34 times
Been thanked: 10 times

Re: Combat in YS. Well... What's left of it.

Post by Strik3agle98 » Tue Nov 27, 2012 2:02 pm

excelent post MR +1 ;)
Image
Image

User avatar
Shiny Rice
57th Polyvalent Sq
57th Polyvalent Sq
Posts: 1389
Joined: Wed Apr 27, 2011 3:28 pm
Favorite Aircraft: Su-35
Has thanked: 28 times
Been thanked: 42 times

Re: Combat in YS. Well... What's left of it.

Post by Shiny Rice » Wed Nov 28, 2012 11:51 am

Well, I arranged a meeting of my squadron lately, and only HB came. We even have our own server, but as far as I know, not much people has been there. And been working on the second version of my squad pack. If some of you guys remember, I organised a combat event a while ago, it was called the Great Urban Furball. Several people came, and though we weren't many, we did have some fun. I might just do the same in some days when I get my comp back.
CO of the 57th Cloud Rippers
"We rip those clouds apart so you can see the sun!"
Now 100% more decomissioned!

User avatar
SvenPhantom
Veteran
Veteran
Posts: 591
Joined: Sun Feb 06, 2011 5:07 pm
Favorite Aircraft: Unspecified
Has thanked: 2 times
Been thanked: 13 times

Re: Combat in YS. Well... What's left of it.

Post by SvenPhantom » Wed Nov 28, 2012 2:30 pm

Agreed, very few people can teach combat well. When you have only a few people who can teach combat well there can be a monopoly hence why the CVW-171 was the only real large squadron hanging around when it was active. We tried efforts of making other people teaching how to dogfight. But it seemed people lacked the dedication or their members lacked the dedication to make it any ways more active or even to rival the CVW-171. That probably discouraged a lot of people and they probably left.
Image
Image
If God had wanted the army to fly, he would have made the sky brown.
If God meant man to fly, He'd have given us bigger wallets.
If God had meant for men to fly he would have made their bones hollow and not their heads.

User avatar
Phoenix
Legend
Legend
Posts: 3153
Joined: Fri Feb 11, 2011 5:54 pm
Favorite Aircraft: Sr-71
Location: On that golden road to Samarkand.
Has thanked: 78 times
Been thanked: 41 times

Re: Combat in YS. Well... What's left of it.

Post by Phoenix » Wed Nov 28, 2012 10:49 pm

One reason I stopped flying on YS, the lack of ANY activity.

I would gladly return if it could help.

Unfortunately I thing this problem was a long time coming. No new squad has managed to survive and only the 171st - from YSP so you all know each other - is stable. Everything anybody else does dies from lack of interest (see 367th, 323rd, 121st, FAVA ATVA 241st VFA-49)

I was once asked why I wanted to lead something so badly, by Iceman I think.

Honestly, I don't! but who is there that will?

User avatar
Midnight Rambler
Staff
Staff
Posts: 2120
Joined: Thu Feb 10, 2011 11:08 pm
Favorite Aircraft: F-16
Location: Australia
OS: Windows 10
Has thanked: 259 times
Been thanked: 360 times

Re: Combat in YS. Well... What's left of it.

Post by Midnight Rambler » Wed Nov 28, 2012 11:22 pm

Okie Dokey.

So we have no one that can teach people to dogfight/blow stuff up.
We have no one wanting to start a squad.
No one with the motivation to stay in a squad.
No one wanting to train in a squad.

Pretty much sums up YS to me. Everyone has lost interest because it's the same thing everyday.

Ahh well.
Image

User avatar
DD-Destroyer
Contributor
Contributor
Posts: 323
Joined: Tue May 22, 2012 11:45 pm
Favorite Aircraft: FA-50 Golden Eagle
Location: Seoul
OS: Windows
Has thanked: 4 times
Been thanked: 164 times
Contact:

Re: Combat in YS. Well... What's left of it.

Post by DD-Destroyer » Thu Nov 29, 2012 12:18 am

It's depends on players mind. Korean Combat Squadrons that like Mad Sharks Joint Force are still activating and attracting other F-Sim(DCS, Lock on, Falcon, FSX, etc.) players to YSF and they are satisfied at our activity.

User avatar
Gunny
Business Class Membership
Business Class Membership
Posts: 3224
Joined: Sun Feb 06, 2011 6:17 pm
Favorite Aircraft: Any thing with a prop.
Location: New Iberia.LA.
OS: Windows XP SP3
Has thanked: 575 times
Been thanked: 731 times

Re: Combat in YS. Well... What's left of it.

Post by Gunny » Thu Nov 29, 2012 1:28 am

If I may add my 2cents to this discussion.Its just my opinion here but the driving force of the YSFHQ combat squadrons has always been the CVW 171st and there leadership ICEMAN and BOMBCAT.And since there presents here has been absent due to real life responsibility.The whole idea of combat squadrons has gone straight down hill and has been given over to VAs.Most of the old combat squadron guard is growing out of YS and going there separate ways in order to have a life in the real world.Just as it should be ya can't stay in never never land forever.I have my own personal reasons for not flying in combat squadrons.But I have always been proud of my affiliation with the 171st as Uncle Gunny.But as for a solution to reviving the interest and dedication to combat squadrons.I think that would be leadership.As to how that would take shape I have no clue.
Image[/align=centre]

User avatar
Bombcat
Staff
Staff
Posts: 935
Joined: Thu Feb 03, 2011 3:08 am
Favorite Aircraft: F-14D Tomcat
Location: Virginia
OS: Windows 7
Has thanked: 138 times
Been thanked: 139 times
Contact:

Re: Combat in YS. Well... What's left of it.

Post by Bombcat » Thu Nov 29, 2012 3:34 am

We came into this thing with some high hopes of tapping into creativity that wasn't really there - squads that weren't just other folks trying to do the same "we do everything" or "we're a naval squad that does everything just like ....". As it is, that never really panned out. Rules may have had a hand in it, the relative inactivity of the leaders (most certainly my bad) had a big hand in it. It's not that YS isn't the game it once was as much as it still is the game it once was, with just enough new bits to make the old bits less compatible then we'd want.

A hand full of people made a number of stabs at revitalizing things with massive, planned events, and the fact that these generally fell through hasn't helped. From my point of view, with the 171st, squads were always strongest when a bunch of like minded people got together to screw around. Find a way to do that again, and we might be able to muster some real combat pilots. Training and such was a nice way to add a little pride into a group that is already strong, but making standards of talent and dedication the end all hasn't done us many favors. As it is, someone starts flinging missiles, and suddenly you've got a kiddie rage ball.

I'd like to advocate some occasional, maybe monthly, get-togethers for folks who still prize what combat in YS used to be. Not necessarily open to all, since too much of the general population is part of what keeps some of us away from the servers. Maybe a few people can find a little of the old spark, but at least we might have some fun with a game that we haven't quite abandoned yet.
[CAG171]Bombcat, Commander, Air Wing 171
Team Awesome # 23
YSFHQ administrator.

User avatar
Philster
Veteran
Veteran
Posts: 558
Joined: Fri Jul 01, 2011 11:57 pm
Favorite Aircraft: Boeing 747
Location: California
Has thanked: 44 times
Been thanked: 59 times

Re: Combat in YS. Well... What's left of it.

Post by Philster » Thu Nov 29, 2012 3:35 am

I started flying less because there was no one to fly with me. Yes, there were always people on the servers, but they we never at the same skill level I was. Things become redundant when you start killing the same people over and over again, along with the same target ranges by yourself.
Image
241st Shadow Hunter
Team Awesome # 241
Soji wrote:They were the last birds who could have been arrested for the criminal negligence.

User avatar
waspe414
Staff
Staff
Posts: 1249
Joined: Thu Feb 10, 2011 9:35 pm
Favorite Aircraft: CH-136 Kiowa, Yak-130 Mitten
Location: Canada
Has thanked: 115 times
Been thanked: 214 times

Re: Combat in YS. Well... What's left of it.

Post by waspe414 » Thu Nov 29, 2012 4:19 am

And when all your friends stop flying.

I got too good, 49th fell apart due to inactivity. I knew the game inside out, I could outfly anyone who came online, and slowly all the people I started flying with, all the people I learned with, all the people I had fun with, disappeared. I have no reason to get on a server, no reason to even start YS anymore. I know the game too well, and don't know the people well enough.
Actual UltraViolet
Image Image
Image
I stole your turnip. Now you must come and defend your honour. ~ Hank Green

User avatar
Philster
Veteran
Veteran
Posts: 558
Joined: Fri Jul 01, 2011 11:57 pm
Favorite Aircraft: Boeing 747
Location: California
Has thanked: 44 times
Been thanked: 59 times

Re: Combat in YS. Well... What's left of it.

Post by Philster » Thu Nov 29, 2012 6:17 am

waspe414 wrote:And when all your friends stop flying.

I got too good, 49th fell apart due to inactivity. I knew the game inside out, I could outfly anyone who came online, and slowly all the people I started flying with, all the people I learned with, all the people I had fun with, disappeared. I have no reason to get on a server, no reason to even start YS anymore. I know the game too well, and don't know the people well enough.
I don't know why, but reading this made me so depressed.
Image
241st Shadow Hunter
Team Awesome # 241
Soji wrote:They were the last birds who could have been arrested for the criminal negligence.

User avatar
Midnight Rambler
Staff
Staff
Posts: 2120
Joined: Thu Feb 10, 2011 11:08 pm
Favorite Aircraft: F-16
Location: Australia
OS: Windows 10
Has thanked: 259 times
Been thanked: 360 times

Re: Combat in YS. Well... What's left of it.

Post by Midnight Rambler » Thu Nov 29, 2012 6:40 am

Kinda cool how everyone has the same thinking pattern.

I think that the 171st being so big had an impact, but everyone wanted to be in the 171st. The aircraft were cool. most members were admin/mods on HQ and they had the biggest majority of good pilots.
Philster wrote:
waspe414 wrote:And when all your friends stop flying.

I got too good, 49th fell apart due to inactivity. I knew the game inside out, I could outfly anyone who came online, and slowly all the people I started flying with, all the people I learned with, all the people I had fun with, disappeared. I have no reason to get on a server, no reason to even start YS anymore. I know the game too well, and don't know the people well enough.
I don't know why, but reading this made me so depressed.
Waspe should write a book.

Some of the best fun I had was in TA (<TA). We just jumped online and screwed around, made jokes and used troll bots. Maybe we should start heading back that way. Lose the rigidity of squads and go back to flying around on a server, shooting people down and not being so serious...
Image

User avatar
Phoenix
Legend
Legend
Posts: 3153
Joined: Fri Feb 11, 2011 5:54 pm
Favorite Aircraft: Sr-71
Location: On that golden road to Samarkand.
Has thanked: 78 times
Been thanked: 41 times

Re: Combat in YS. Well... What's left of it.

Post by Phoenix » Thu Nov 29, 2012 9:11 am

Nah, even on the individual side of combat there is not much to look forward to.
I note that the Dogfighting blacklist (that great attempt to rank pilots and start a competition) has been forgotten for months.
The Airstrike challenge only had four entries, (although that was probably due to my making it harder by asking for ALL targets to be destroyed).

Simply put, the number of people interested in flying in a squad, is enough to just about make up a squad. And nobody wants to be bothered with any Air to ground stuff. (mind you, I had a great time going anti ship on the 171).

Also, it seems on HQ there is little activity on flying on YS as most of the talk is on modding, or website assistance.

Bombcat wrote:We came into this thing with some high hopes of tapping into creativity that wasn't really there - squads that weren't just other folks trying to do the same "we do everything" or "we're a naval squad that does everything just like ....". As it is, that never really panned out. Rules may have had a hand in it, the relative inactivity of the leaders (most certainly my bad) had a big hand in it. It's not that YS isn't the game it once was as much as it still is the game it once was, with just enough new bits to make the old bits less compatible then we'd want.

A hand full of people made a number of stabs at revitalizing things with massive, planned events, and the fact that these generally fell through hasn't helped. From my point of view, with the 171st, squads were always strongest when a bunch of like minded people got together to screw around. Find a way to do that again, and we might be able to muster some real combat pilots. Training and such was a nice way to add a little pride into a group that is already strong, but making standards of talent and dedication the end all hasn't done us many favors. As it is, someone starts flinging missiles, and suddenly you've got a kiddie rage ball.
About the events, it seemed mostly a lack of interest or coordination. I think (of the many aborted ones I tried) all seemed to go down for lack of interest. ok so the last one was my fault entirely (and I'm sorry) but nobody wants to fly anything like this any more. If you ask what do they want and when? they will still not come.

On the dogfighting rules, it seems not many can be bothered to learn to fight with guns, it takes time and effort and many don't want to do such a thing.
I'd like to advocate some occasional, maybe monthly, get-togethers for folks who still prize what combat in YS used to be. Not necessarily open to all, since too much of the general population is part of what keeps some of us away from the servers. Maybe a few people can find a little of the old spark, but at least we might have some fun with a game that we haven't quite abandoned yet.
I would gladly come. Even if this is just a furball which you would dominate everyone over I would come.

TL;DR nobody wants to be bothered with anything that can take time or is not a furball.

Ok I'll start a list. Please quote and add your name if yo still want to see any form of event or squad like stuff on YS.
Phoenix

Varren

Re: Combat in YS. Well... What's left of it.

Post by Varren » Thu Nov 29, 2012 4:27 pm

I'll keep my response short.

As you can tell by this topic, there's still some blood in Combat YS. I personally blame the forum rules, they're causing squadrons to constantly do training events, which as you can guess - gets pretty boring pretty quickly. If the forum rules aren't going to change, then we may aswell say goodbye to combat squadrons now. People join Combat squadrons for proper COMBAT, not little training combat events where everyone's friends.

Although if wars were to be allowed, I'd make it so there is a forum that only members of squadron user groups could view, anyone fighting outside that forum would be desiplined as the admins see fit. Another rivalry like the 49th and 171st would actually help YS, and all the bickering would be out of public view.

User avatar
USCG Helo 1
Contributor
Contributor
Posts: 134
Joined: Thu Feb 10, 2011 6:28 am
Favorite Aircraft: A-10C Warthog
Has thanked: 1 time
Been thanked: 2 times

Re: Combat in YS. Well... What's left of it.

Post by USCG Helo 1 » Thu Nov 29, 2012 5:01 pm

Varren wrote: Although if wars were to be allowed, I'd make it so there is a forum that only members of squadron user groups could view, anyone fighting outside that forum would be desiplined as the admins see fit. Another rivalry like the 49th and 171st would actually help YS, and all the bickering would be out of public view.
Maybe, maybe not. The problem with wars and rivalries is that, over time, people start thinking with their guns and not their brains. This leads to people losing friends, getting banned, and leaving the forum. Also, they tend to have a negative affect on the community, with everyone disagreeing about anything and everything just to spite the other. Wars are ok, but only, in my opinion, if they're short.

What I think would be good would be more combat based events, like WW3 way back in the day on YSP. They provide good opportunities for combat, chances for trash talking and other such things, and you don't have to be in a squad to attend. After a while, more people would get back into the combat aspect of YS, more squads would start popping up, and older squads that are still there would get more applicants.
Phoenix wrote: Unfortunately I thing this problem was a long time coming. No new squad has managed to survive and only the 171st - from YSP so you all know each other - is stable. Everything anybody else does dies from lack of interest (see 36h, 323rd, 121st, FAVA ATVA 241st VFA-49)
Whoever said we were gone? We may be largely inactive, but we're still here. I've got to give our guys props. Throughout the past couple of months, we've had no activity, but when they were called, almost everyone answered. We're starting to pull things together to see if we can get things back up and running. Granted, a few snags have been hit, but we're making progress.
Image
Only the weak boast, only the humiliated insult. Honor is not shown by your prowess in combat, but by your character and ability to uphold others and stay loyal to them. Honor is union, honor is discipline, honor is pride.

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest