AAA avoidance

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AAA avoidance

Post by Phoenix » Sun Feb 13, 2011 6:50 pm

I would like to say that if you go to 10,000ft+, the AAA cant reach you.

on Aomori, using an A-4 with just bombs, I climbed to 10-12,000ft, dive-bombed, climbed again and did the same again, AAA could not reach me.

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Re: AAA avoidance

Post by Shutter » Sun Feb 13, 2011 6:58 pm

Quite true. Additionally, if you fly under an angle of 30 degrees for the stock aaa, they cannot hit you. Ships are different, they have no aaa bottom.

Missile avoidance altitude is 40000ft, normal stock sams will not fire at you under 200 ft.

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Re: AAA avoidance

Post by Phoenix » Sun Feb 13, 2011 7:12 pm

actually they will, but miss with out locking on.

Also, if a SAM is onto you, release a flare and PULL UP, just go a different direction so it won't re-lock on to you.

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Re: AAA avoidance

Post by waspe414 » Sun Feb 13, 2011 7:31 pm

Shutter wrote:normal stock sams will not fire at you under 200 ft.
Actually, they have a minimum firing angle of 30°.

Anyone know the turn rate for any of the missiles?
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Re: AAA avoidance

Post by Phoenix » Sun Feb 13, 2011 7:33 pm

I don't know the turn rate, but if you go at speed 1,000, you will out-run them!

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Re: AAA avoidance

Post by Bombcat » Mon Feb 14, 2011 3:37 am

waspe414 wrote:
Shutter wrote:normal stock sams will not fire at you under 200 ft.
Actually, they have a minimum firing angle of 30°.

Anyone know the turn rate for any of the missiles?
I can't say that I do know the turn rate of the missiles, except that you cannot reliably defeat a missile which is on your 6 with a tight last minute turn. By placing a missile on your wingtip, and turning into it a few seconds before impact can reliably defeat the AIM-9 and AIM-120, but I've not personally tested it yet on the AIM-9X. SAM sites do not currently employ the AIM-9X.

One tactic which I find to be useful is to turn tail and try to outrun surface to air missiles when they fire. If you do this in a supersonic aircraft near the outside edge of the weapon's range, you stand a very good chance of escaping clean. This can be a good way to conserve flares if you are making rocket attacks against ships.

Right now, the most challenging regularly encountered SAM shooter is the stock Udaloy class destroyer. Capable of volley firing mid-range missiles, the ship will engage at 8000 meters. This is not far form the outside of your rocket range, and well outside the range of AGM's. Fortunately, these missiles are quite weak, and even if you cannot evade all of them, a single hit will generally not be enough to bring you down.
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Re: AAA avoidance

Post by Dragon029 » Mon Feb 14, 2011 6:57 am

EDIT: Just so you know, this is just personal encounters and my own personal guidelines; those that perform actual experiments, gauging angles and ranges will have more credible info.

Just about all AAA I encounter will fire directly at me when I'm above 100ft.
At under 100ft, they'll fire in your direction, but they won't aim low enough.
Take them out before you fly past them and you'll be fine (just come in at like 80ft and engage them with guns / rockets at like 3 miles or so.

From my experience; for most SAM:

They will not lock onto you at under 100ft (unless you're within a couple hundred ft of them), and their missiles will not reach over 40,000ft.

For breaking lock, keep switching radar between the range that you can see the SAM site and 10-5mile ranges (depending on how alert you are).
When you see a missile within 5-10 miles of you, launch a single flare and move to the left or right and if possible, decrease altitude (unless you're close to 40,000ft).
Once you've dropped a flare, extend your radar range and watch enemy missiles, as soon as you see new missiles start to change course away from the flare and towards you, swap back to the 5-10 mile radar and wait; when once get close, drop a second flare and repeat the process until you're out of range.

It is also possible to dodge missiles without flares, but generally you want to be headed towards the missile / SAM.

Outrunning missiles also works, but can be risky and has a lot of variables.
One recent example though was while I was in an F-111 at Mach 2.5 and flying at perhaps 20,000ft.

In this case though it was very close.

Last of all, when trying to get away from SAM, work on 2 levels; keep an eye on which direction you've projected flares (so that you don't fly back in front of it) and also keep an eye on your exit path, ensuring that you're not circling around the enemy in order to evade missiles.


More lastly than the other last of all, keep an eye on your aircraft - my new PAK FA employs a more realistic flare system where flares are shot upwards of the aircraft.
With this capability, it's possible to simply roll 90 degrees, pop a flare, roll back and keep flying.
However, it also means that if pop a flare last minute and try to do the usual pull-up, you'll find yourself sitting with the flare right between you and the missile. (In other words, in this PAK FA, you need to roll, then pitch after deploying a flare).
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Re: AAA avoidance

Post by Phoenix » Mon Feb 14, 2011 3:51 pm

I'll look forward to using the PAK FA aircraft.

Note: Default stealth aircraft (like the B-2) can be found by SAMs. They (the SAMs) are that good.

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Re: AAA avoidance

Post by Bombcat » Tue Feb 15, 2011 3:37 am

Stealth was never seriously expected to make an aircraft invisible to radar, but rather, to reduce the range at which a radar system could effectively track an aircraft so that the stealth plane could either maneuver to avoid radar emitters or get the first shot. In YS, stealth is calculated as a fraction of 1. I believe that the effective lock on range of missiles may be reduced by the level of stealth, i.e. an aircraft with a stealth setting of 0.7 would reduce the effective lock-on range of an 8km missile to 5.6km.

Stock stealth aircraft are generally handicapped by their reliance on internal weapons, as opening the bomb doors removes much or all of the aircraft's stealth properties, making it competently vulnerable to hostile fire.

If anyone is better informed on the workings of the YS stealth system, please improve on this info.
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Re: AAA avoidance

Post by Phoenix » Tue Mar 01, 2011 6:28 pm

Do SAM's act as A-AAMs do?

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Re: AAA avoidance

Post by Shutter » Tue Mar 01, 2011 9:16 pm

ys doesn't really have sams, they just have air to air missiles shot from ground objects. And no, the aim-9x is not yet on any stock ground object to my knowledge.

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Re: AAA avoidance

Post by Bombcat » Wed Mar 02, 2011 3:17 am

There is nothing unusual about SAMs being essentially the same weapons as AAMs. The designations only really tell you where the missile is launched, not what it's like. The Sidewinder, AMRAAM, and Sparrow have all been the sources of significant western SAM systems, much as they are in YS.

The SAMs fired from the Udaloy class destroyers appear as mid range missiles, but behave very much like A-AAM's. Though both the YS mid-ranger and the A-AAM missiles feature the reengagement tracking capability, the Udaloy SAMs demonstrate shorter range and reduced hitting power more like the smaller weapons.
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Re: AAA avoidance

Post by vincent » Sat Mar 05, 2011 10:43 am

I second Bombcat's post. In addition, if you press the "who killed me" button in network mode after you were killed by a sam, you will see something like aim9.

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Re: AAA avoidance

Post by Phoenix » Sun Mar 27, 2011 2:24 pm

Do ships have a minimum firing angle?

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Re: AAA avoidance

Post by SvenPhantom » Sun Mar 27, 2011 3:21 pm

Phoenix wrote:Do ships have a minimum firing angle?
Some ships have a minimum firing angle when it comes to missiles, exceptions like the stock udaloy. But ship's aaa defenses do not have a minimum firing angle.l
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Re: AAA avoidance

Post by Phoenix » Sun Mar 27, 2011 3:21 pm

Anyone got a tip on avoiding shipborne AAA?

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Re: AAA avoidance

Post by SvenPhantom » Sun Mar 27, 2011 3:29 pm

Phoenix wrote:Anyone got a tip on avoiding shipborne AAA?
Yes, don't get really close to it (few hundred feet), the shipborne AAA is very short range compared to the ground AAA.
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Re: AAA avoidance

Post by Phoenix » Sun Mar 27, 2011 3:39 pm

So besides AGMs, what is the best weapon?

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Re: AAA avoidance

Post by Animal » Sun Mar 27, 2011 3:47 pm

think this through yourself. What properties make the AGM ideal for attacking ship and what other weapons posess those qualities. We can't hold your hand through every tiny thing.
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Re: AAA avoidance

Post by Phoenix » Sun Mar 27, 2011 3:55 pm

Good point. I think rockets may be an idea.

I do think things through, but I often miss things, I was just asking in case anyone had a good idea.

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